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2 months ago

Barbara R. Cochran, MFA  See profile asked this question:

Language pair:

Italian > English

Subject:

General

Level of diffculty:

Easy / medium

Word or term in question:

percorso all'andata

Context:

Ottenuta la risposta di Guyuk, Giovanni de Pian Carpine e il suo compagno ripresero la via di ritorno, seguendo lo stesso itinerario percorso all'andata, ma tra fatiche e stenti resi più gravosi dalla lunga permanenza in terra straniera, fra genti ostili, nel continuo timore di incomprensioni e inganni.

 

 

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Answers on this question

2 months ago

Carlos Pablo MIGUES-LABANCA, BSc.  See my profile wrote:

retraversing the same path they had followed on the outward voyage

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2 months ago

plaisirsdelavie  See my profile wrote:

Comments by other colleagues on this answer:

2 months ago

exegete  See profile wrote:

I agree: "retrace one's steps" is standard English for "(ri)tornare sui propri passi" (in French: "revenir sur ses pas", "rebrousser chemin"). https://www.wordreference.com/enit/retrace https://www.wordreference.com/fren/rebrousser%20chemin https://www.wordreference.com/enfr/retrace : "If you lose your keys, try retracing your steps to see where you left them." https://www.thefreedictionary.com/retrace : "retrace: 1. to go back over (one's steps, a route, etc) again: we **retraced the route** we took last summer." "retrace: 1. to **trace backward**; go back over: to retrace one's steps." However, I see nothing wrong with: "(they) resumed their return trip, following the same itinerary as on the outward journey" I see no need for shortening the sentence to: "(they) resumed their return trip, retracing their route/path" Especially as it was a very long trip: "Ha così inizio ***il lunghissimo e avventuroso viaggio di Giovanni da Pian del Carpine*** fino a Karakorum, ***alla corte del Gran Khan Guyuk****; ***due anni e mezzo*** costellati di spettacoli raccapriccianti, fatiche e stenti, ma anche di racconti e incontri favolosi." at http://www.lulu.com/shop/giovanni-da-pian-del-carpine/storia-dei-mongoli/paperback/product-20513981.html "Güyük Khan (...) was the third Great Khan of the Mongol Empire" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%BCy%C3%BCk_Khan "Giovanni da Pian del Carpine (..) was a medieval Italian diplomat, archbishop and explorer - and ***one of the first Europeans to enter the court of the Great Khan of the Mongol Empire***. He is the author of the earliest important Western account of northern and central Asia, Rus, and other regions of the Mongol dominion." at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giovanni_da_Pian_del_Carpine

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2 months ago

Charles Ferguson  See my profile wrote:

the same route as they went

My comment:

My inclination is to keep it simple, but of course that's dependent on your own preferences.

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2 months ago

exegete  See profile wrote:

Dear Charles, I cannot find any Internet occurrence of that expression. It sounds to me like oral English, but incorrect English - yet I might be wrong... Can you offer any link (hyperlink) proving your suggestion?

2 months ago

Charles Ferguson  See profile wrote:

http://www.rotary-ribi.org/districts/page.php?PgID=553607&DistrictNo= The translation is conversational and not an elevated way of saying things, but it does exist. The style is on the preference of the translator.

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2 months ago

Josephine Cassar  See my profile wrote:

on the outward journey

My comment:

taking the same itinerary they had taken for the outward/outbound/first leg: https://www.wordreference.com/iten/andata

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2 months ago

exegete  See profile wrote:

AGREE. Indeed, the Collins dictionary (reliable) on Wordreference.com says: "andata [anˈdata] sf (viaggio): outward journey ***all'andata*** c'era brutto tempo: ***on the outward journey*** there was bad weather" See also the translation into French of a similar English expression: (since you understand French): "***outward route n (= outbound course of a journey) : aller*** nm The outward route was via Carlisle and the return was via York." --- "First leg" (the other answer here below) is for SPORTS: the same dictionary as here above adds: "partita/girone di andata (***Sport***): ***first leg***/first half of the season" and in its English-French part: "***1st leg: match aller*** !! Celtic won the first leg 2-0. : Celtic a gagné le match aller 2 à 0. 2nd leg : match retour" at https://www.wordreference.com/enfr/leg?s=first%20leg

2 months ago

Josephine Cassar  See profile wrote:

We do use first leg if it is a planned journey with various stops/parts though; if it is just the coming and returning, we would use 'outbound/outward journey/part of the journey.

2 months ago

exegete  See profile wrote:

Yes, I was just going to add that: "leg" also means "stage of a journe" (in French: "étape"). But this is in the SAME DIRECTION as the rest of the journey. Whereas here we speak of a return trip. See our WordReference.com page again: "(stage)[of journey] : étape (f)" at https://www.wordreference.com/enfr/leg So the first answer was WRONG in any case... ;-)

2 months ago

Josephine Cassar  See profile wrote:

No, I understand that they went back the way they had come when they had their answer, taking the same way, just like they had come.

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2 months ago

John Pinna  See my profile wrote:

the same itinerary as their departure/first leg

My comment:

Hi Barbara,

"percorso all'andata" - "traveled at departure/first leg"

BUT

I found this a bit tricky to word naturally in English. Ultimately, I think a little rewording wouldn't hurt: "After receiving Guyuk's answer, G de PC and his companion resumed their return trip, following the same itinerary as their departure/first leg..."

I'm curious to see what other translators have to say.

Good luck!

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